Comparing English with other Languages?

[Monica28]

I think I’ll watch the movie when I find it.

But I’d like to go back to your question because I had an answer but I forgot to write it; the question was:

“What do I say or what do I think?”

You might think, but I’ll never know what, until you tell me. And you might prefer not to tell me, I just don’t know. Simple?
Therefore, if I want to know your opinion, I will ask: “What do you say?”
Moreover, when you say something, it means that you thought at it first, although there are many people who speak without thinking, which is definitely not your case
So, is my question wrong? Or just not suitable in English?
What do you say?

[Irish_Lurker]

@Monica28

@Irish Lurker

I read the German Version of
“The Englishman Who Went Up a Hill But Came Down a Mountain”
quite quickly. (hadn’t a clue what was going on :-))

And? did you like it?
Would I like it?
Should I read it if I find it? (in English, maybe)

I have tried reading this small book so many times I think I know most of it off by heart
but I just can’t seem to get any real distance.

[Irish_Lurker]

@Monica28

So, is my question wrong? Or just not suitable in English?
What do you say?

“Define wrong”

I think it’s more about the inflexion of “Good Example”? rather thank "what do you think? When you stress “Good Example” the question is clearly “do you think this is a good example”?

If I were you I would say “what do you think” simply because it is more common to say it. I think any slight variations on the literal translation are less important than the desire to sound more natural.

“what do you say” might be more US English I’m not sure? All I can say is I would use “think” rather than say simply because it just sounds slightly more natural to me.
If you would like to really beat it to death try here…

enkivillage.com/figure-of-speech.html

[Monica28]

@Irish Lurker

@Monica28

So, is my question wrong? Or just not suitable in English?
What do you say?

[size=150]If you would like to really beat it to death try here…[/size]

Haha I don’t want to beat it to death!

[Irish_Lurker]

@Monica28

Haha I don’t want to beat it to death!

That’s good because the literal meaning of a phrase (the sum total of their constituent parts) doesn’t always mean “exactly” what they say(implies) People are often lazy

But of course you already know this Mons as I’m sure it applies to nearly every language.

But I would also think that highlighting such things often signifies an enhanced awareness of the Language above an intermediate level.

And over time

We often chose what…

Is easier to say
Sounds better
Is most often said (popular use)

Which, of course, can be confusing to anyone learning a new language as it may not

seem logical.?

[Monica28]

@Irish Lurker

@Monica28

Haha I don’t want to beat it to death!

[size=117]That’s good because the literal meaning of a phrase (the sum total of their constituent parts) doesn’t always mean “exactly” what they say(implies) People are often lazy

But of course you already know this Mons as I’m sure it applies to nearly every language.[/size]

Yes, they are called Idioms and I think they are the special colours of any language.

Let’s learn and have fun!

***

***

Too much? Ok, I know what’s next for me:

Till we meet again …

[Irish_Lurker]

@Monica28

Yes, they are called Idioms and I think they are the special colours of any language.

Ok lets really beat it to death with a rolled up newspaper.

I myself wouldn’t call what I’m talking about idioms.

“a group of words established by usage as having a meaning not deducible from those of the individual words”.

What do you think or what do you say basically imply the same thing.

What do you say(or think), good example?

and

good example, what do you say(or think) also imply the same thing.

I was just giving my opinion that "What do you think), good example? sounded more natural to me… that’s all I swear Mons… can we please just leave it at that? :-).

[Irish_Lurker]

youtube.com/watch?v=m5WHFSCh7EM

What do you think of my new Pferdeschwanz Mons

[Monica28]

@Irish Lurker

Ok lets really beat it to death with a rolled up newspaper.

I myself wouldn’t call what I’m talking about idioms.

“a group of words established by usage as having a meaning not deducible from those of the individual words”.

Who’s beating it to death now? Me or you?!

A rolled-up newspaper is very useful, did you know? You can kill flies with it

But I still think that yours is a successful idiom. What’s an idiom? Look:

If “beat it to death” is not an idiom, what is it then? Tell me, please! I’m sure you’re waiting for me around the corner, but I hope there’s no newspaper in your hand

@Irish Lurker

I was just giving my opinion that "What do you think), good example? sounded more natural to me… that’s all I swear Mons… can we please just leave it at that? :-).

Ok, since you swear it so … nicely, then let’s move on … to the cognates!

[Monica28]

… in fact, let’s move on to your new Pferdeschwanz, this is what I wanted to say.

Well, I expected it to be more spectacular.
But it’s good enough the way it is.

Moving on to the “cognates” now, I found out they are words in different languages which have the same origin.
The video is good for those who like discovering cognates, but it seemed boring to me.
Therefore, I tried to build a new version in French, apart from the Google’s. Just as an ecker size, you know

Mon père aimait beaucoup marcher
Et c’est que j’ai dans mon sang aussi,
Alors je marche vivement tant beaucoup que je peux
Et je lève (je salue par) mon chapeau.

Je te salue!
À bientôt!

[Irish_Lurker]

The point is Mons “What do you think, good example”? is not an idiom.

An Idiom is a play on words and the above is clearly not a play on words.
Its meaning is also “literally” very clear.

[Monica28]

@Irish Lurker

The point is Mons “What do you think, good example”? is not an idiom.

Of course it’s not an idiom! And I was not home to tell it to you earlier…
How could you think that I thought that was an idiom? don’t you know me?
It looks that we’re not speaking the same language today…
Never mind, listen:

The point is, Jamie, that I was speaking about your “beat it to death”.

Don’t say that “beat it to death” is not an idiom please!
I would cry all night if you say that!
Like this :-(((
And I will have a headache also, high blood pressure, and who knows what else, I won’t continue, because you told me so many times not to exaggerate.

See you!

[Irish_Lurker]

@Monica28

Don’t say that “beat it to death” is not an idiom please!

Well? In my opinion beat it to death is simply “Sarcasm”
But while you’re crying yourself to sleep hears some relaxing music to slow you right down while you’re counting sheep.
youtube.com/watch?v=S1O0m9UXAwk

[Irish_Lurker]

@Monica28

Don’t say that “beat it to death” is not an idiom please!

Well? In my opinion beat it to death is simply “Sarcasm”
But while you’re crying yourself to sleep hears some relaxing music to slow you right down while you’re counting sheep. Not like that noisy nonsense Torsten is into at the moment.

youtube.com/watch?v=S1O0m9UXAwk

[Monica28]

@Irish Lurker

Well? In my opinion beat it to death is simply “Sarcasm”

I don’t think so and I don’t agree! I’m getting my toys to go home!

@Irish Lurker

But while you’re crying yourself to sleep hears some relaxing music to slow you right down while you’re counting sheep. Not like that noisy nonsense Torsten is into at the moment.

Before going home, know that I usually count very fast, so at the time you sent me that sensitive song I was sleeping already, so I’m sorry but I missed pauve petit Johnny last night.
I found him early in the morning, and he was very inspiring: because of him I woke up quickly, jumped out of the bed and went shopping. So it was a good start for a beautiful day, thanks to Jamie and Johnny.
I’m not working today, as it’s a day off here and I made some plans which happened to get changed.
It’s really a summer day today, excellent for getting a beautiful suntan which I’m going to do right now.
Not before proposing a song to the child inside you and to all children in the world.

It’s Children’s Day, isn’t it? This song is not as sweet as yours :-), not as noisy as Torsten’s :-), but almost.
Just give it a click please, because I can’t paste it directly, the way you do
youtube.com/watch?v=MGoir9pp2MU

[Irish_Lurker]

@Monica28

@Irish Lurker

Well? In my opinion beat it to death is simply “Sarcasm”

I don’t think so and I don’t agree! I’m getting my toys to go home!

OK What is the difference between “Eating humble pie” and “Don’t beat it to death”? One is hyperbole, the other is an idiom.

“Eating humble pie” is an example of an idiom, a phrase that contains more than one meaning. “Don’t beat it to death” is hyperbole, or exaggeration.
I also think idioms are more a cultural phenomenon not a linguistic one.
And I’m doubly sorry Mons because IMHO Rod is better
youtube.com/watch?v=FOt3oQ_k008

[Monica28]

@Irish Lurker

OK What is the difference between “Eating humble pie” and “Don’t beat it to death”? One is hyperbole, the other is an idiom.

“Eating humble pie” is an example of an idiom, a phrase that contains more than one meaning. “Don’t beat it to death” is hyperbole, or exaggeration.
I also think idioms are more a cultural phenomenon not a linguistic one.

No, no, no. You want to trick me again, but I won’t let you.
Don’t beat it to death is a hyperbole when it refers to beating someone until he dies - the sum of the words’ meaning, exaggerating the action of beating.

When Don’t beat it to death means Don’t continue this discussion unnecessarily, just stop 'cause it’s enough, there’s no point to go on with it…, then it is an idiom because it means something else than the individual words indicate.

This is how I understand it and why I say it is an idiom. I’m sure you won’t agree, and I’m sorry, but I can survive with it.

@Irish Lurker

And I’m doubly sorry Mons because IMHO Rod is better

Rod is a great artist, I liked his songs. Have you ever…
youtube.com/watch?v=2oX2FSv4Rys

Helmut Lotti? I don’t know much of his shows, but I want to watch some. He seems to compete with Andre Rieu, but no, I don’t want to say anything until I see his performance for myself. From only one song I can’t say anything , except that I like it.

IMHO we can’t compare Rod Stewart and Helmut Lotti because they don’t do the same music.
I am sailing with Rod is better because it’s the original, and it fits there, so you’re right in a way.

You gave me a great clue. Thank you!

[Irish_Lurker]

@Monica28

No, no, no. You want to trick me again, but I won’t let you.
Don’t beat it to death is a hyperbole when it refers to beating someone until he dies - the sum of the words’ meaning, exaggerating the action of beating.

No no no no!! (4xno means I win) More fallacious logic

“It” means whatever the context says it means.
In this case “It” refers to our discussion which clearly means that Monserello Monica Monarco is beating “it”(this discussion) to death with a wet Fish.(Mackerel)
If I had pleaded for you to stop the XXXXXXXXXXXX that is also hyperbole.
Right I have just googled Vernacular Masturbation and nothing came up so I have removed it as it might seem inappropriate - I’m guessing it must be just a term used by Pseudo intellectual Belfast Males? But I will say this kind of Validates my earlier remark about idioms and Culture.

But I just had an idea

Why not PM Bees and ask(beg) her to back you up in a kind of Radical

Feminist campaign against the Patriarchy.

Then we could make this last at least to the end of the Week.

@Monica28

I am sailing with Rod is better because it’s the original, and it fits there, so you’re right in a way.

Even More fallacious assertions

1/ Rod Stewarts “Sailing” is not the original version.
2/ Being the “Original” version of a song does not mean it is “Better”
As you will see I think If you were the Black Knight Mons you would still be threatening to bite me to death.
youtube.com/watch?v=poDjuRla … oDjuRlaNAg

[Monica28]

I’m going to cut your message in little pieces, if you don’t mind, James:

@Irish Lurker

“It” means whatever the context says it means.
In this case “It” refers to our discussion which clearly means that Monserello Monica Monarco is beating “it”(this discussion) to death with a wet Fish.(Mackerel)

“It” could also be a poor animal that someone beats to death: a dog, a cat, possible my wet Mackerel, why not ? You see, people are so cruel sometimes… and when we speak about that, what do we have? … voilà… c’est la hyoperbole!
Don’t say this is also a fallacious assertion, because I already know it.

BTW: this word: “fallacious” which I have never heard of, takes me to the words “disastrous” or “calamitous”, but I hope that what I did lately is not that bad

Ok, I exaggerated a little, but anyway, I still think that “beat it to death” in the context of an endless debate is still an idiom. And now, we can take all over again… how funny, isn’t it?

@Irish Lurker

1/ Rod Stewarts “Sailing” is not the original version.

Good that I brought it up, otherwise I wouldn’t have ever known it. See? you’re not talking to the wind here

@Irish Lurker

2/ Being the “Original” version of a song does not mean it is “Better”

This is true and I even bringing the first evidence to support you: I don’t like Sutherland Brother Band’s version. I like Rod’s although it’s not the “Original”.
See that I am correct?

@Irish Lurker

As you will see I think If you were the Black Knight Mons you would still be threatening to bite me to death.

I think that “to bite me to death” in your context is a hyperbole. If not, you can contradict me and we’ll take it all over again or I will accept, who knows?

To change the subject: if you hadn’t removed the term Vernacular Masturbation from your post, I would have said that we have a … metaphor… :-)))))
Good that you removed it! Otherwise “we could have made this last at least to the end of the” year!
But I really think we should move on.
Not before clarifying the idioms issue though

[Monica28]

Dear teachers,

IL and I are going through a difficult moment now. In fact it’s not difficult, it’s rather funny. That funny that we got stuck in the middle of a long living thread and we can’t go on
So please tell me: what is “beat it to death” in the context of a debate: an idiom or a hyperbole? Or maybe something else?

Kind regards,
Monica