What's the next big thing? Fancy an electric car?

Hasn’t Camcorder, Computer and mobiles phone technology really exploded in the last decade or so - I can actually remember being able to predict various milestones simply from gauging demand and how they just seemed a natural progression of what we already had - it was almost as if certain advances became inevitable

I remember a chance meeting with the manager of “Saturn” Electrics on Schönhauser Allee (my local electrical shop)Berlin - I had been looking for a capture card for my computer to download footage from my camcorder and had already asked a few of the staff who just looked bored and unimpressed… “Mr Irishman I am very sorry but you are 2 years too early.” He exclaimed.
He then explained that he knew what I was trying to do but just felt at that moment in time it wasn’t really practical as it would just cost me a fortune - simply because a capture card was 2000DM(1000 Euro) the Software I would need was probably even more and with such a small Hard drive I would only be able to edit a few minutes of film at any one time “What you are wanting has not been made yet - you must just wait for two more years”.He repeated
It was clear the manager and I both had similar thoughts, just he was obviously in a better position to explain and predict… So strangely enough it was approx 2 years later in Belfast when I spied an Apple IMac G4 with - Massive hard drive, fire wire - which just connected straight into your camcorder and the editing software (I Movie) was included as standard. It was as if something, which had been a joke for a long time, became real…

But lots of things, which were almost a joke, are no longer a joke…

Remember Joke mobile phones

Remember Joke Computers

Remember Joke Camcorders

Well they are not jokes anymore! - So what’s the next big thing?
Ok don’t laugh - could it finally be Electric cars?
One of the biggest developments in recent years from the Laptop, Camcorder and phone technologies has been Lithium Ion batteries. They last so much longer and charge much quicker so could this new battery technology be the missing link electric cars have been waiting on.
OK they are expensive but weren’t DVD players and flat screen TV’s when they first came out?
Could a mass produced electric car be just around the corner?

Just remember that once you have one: -

Your not buying petrol or diesel - the projected price is one euro every 150 Kilometer’s or so - but even this should come down not up.

They are much easier to fix.

An electric car will last a lot longer.

So basically the technology is here - it’s just the price that’s stopping us.

I just wonder how much a car like the one below will cost in the next two years? :slight_smile:
well from what I can see - if we can get cheap Lithium ion Batteries then surely the sky is the limit…and were’s the best place to find Lithium? you guessed it -[size=200]CHINA!! [/size]
youtube.com/watch?v=_zWOlPGd … re=related

So is the dawn of the electric car not merely just a question of when?

Will we soon be driving electric cars? I don’t think so and here is why. First, you need to charge the batteries which takes about 10 hours. Where and when will you do that? Most people park their cars on public streets so they can’t charge the batteries themselves. A solution to that problem would be a network of charging stations where you can replace your batteries.

These charging stations would be pretty much like petrol stations only that instead of fuel they would offer charged electric batteries. But even if conventional chains started offering this service, you still would need to produce the energy needed to charge the batteries. How do you produce electric power? Primarily by using nuclear power stations or so called ‘renewable energy’.

Instead of electric cars we might start driving fuel cell driven vehicles in 10 to 15 years. Have you ever thought about that, Jamie?

By the way, what do you think of [url=http://www.english-test.net/forum/ftopic63779.html#anyone_of_you_have_a_solar_powered_cell_phone]Anyone of you have a solar powered cell phone?

That super car motor was just a sporty(Bad) example - the following Mitsubishi car can take a 80% charge in 30 minutes or 50% in 10 minutes - So with a 100 mile range 50 miles after a cup of coffee is not to bad at all

Skip the first minute of music

youtube.com/watch?v=s2x1lB0rWvo

Most people park their cars outside their houses (all you need is a cable running to it from an ordinary 13 amp plug)- so it could be charged anytime not only at night. Restaurants and coffee shops could also offer a free “top up”

Over time the range will increase and the charge time will decrease so I can’t help thinking about the computer I bought 15 years ago…and its RAM and silly processor its 7 Gig Hard drive and the prehistoric modem…

Certainly from what I can see - these yanks now have a real product which will soon get better…what will it be like in a few years??

Check this link out
youtube.com/user/MitsubishiT … 4Qod5zXH1g
I really think its gonna happen…

Lurker says Invest in Lithium now!

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Jamie, do you mean that most people who have cars also own a house? I know a lot of countries where most of the car owners don’t have their how house. Also, how much will it cost to top up a car battery?

I think the oil industry lobby is still very strong and not all of them will support the new technology. However, eventually we will abandon combustion engines and replace them with an alternative which will either be electric motors or fuel cell technology.[YSaerTTEW443543]

TOEIC listening, question-response: What was your former occupation?[YSaerTTEW443543]

Hehe!!! :slight_smile:
Its the battery technology which is making the difference Fuel Cells are coming
Electric cars are here now - They are real!
House or Apartment ownership ? dunno why you mentioned that but anywhere you live will have mains electric so were’s the problem

Price? - The English Journalist guy in the Mitsubishi clip (click the link) quoted one hundred miles for one English pound - which is pretty dam cheap.

But not only that - the car will have very low wear and tear,need much less repairs ,last much longer than a normal car, have almost zero risk of fire and lots of other advantages which would offset any initial extra manufacturing costs…

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Oh no here he goes again!..

Ok I think one of the reasons Im banging on about this is - my career in Construction…
When I first finished my initial skills training cordless or “Batterie” power tools were basically a “DIY” joke. Its slightly more than a decade ago that Professionals started using battery tools for certain jobs simply for “handiness” an obvious example would be a cordless hammer drill used to install a satellite dish on a chimney.
youtube.com/watch?v=5as3kp6R9as
Then came various screw guns and impact drivers etc - but now with these new lithium batteries Professional mechanics are actually using them as impact spanners for taking wheel nuts off. - A job which would have been unthinkable before and always reserved for “air tools” driven by a compressor.

So it seems a revolution is taking place in industry with these new lithium batteries… and the market is exploding rapidly and in a way its really the latest developments in Phone, laptop and power tool batterie technology that has bee driving forward the new “Electric car” technology.

Lurker rant - 11-12-10

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Ok I’m calling this all the way in… Once we get a sub 20,000 Car - the sky is the limit. - The word they use in todays express story is"Revolution"

We are almost there.

Could we look back at these first electric cars like we look back at the MODEL T Ford

 ---    Lurker

youtube.com/watch?v=S4KrIMZpwCY

£5,000 SLASHED FROM PRICES TO SPARK ELECTRIC CAR REVOLUTION


Wednesday December 15,2010
By John Ingham
Have your say(4)
Britain’s electric car revolution stepped up a gear yesterday with the unveiling of nine models eligible for grants of up to £5,000 each.
Transport Secretary Philip Hammond also announced that five more regions are to instal 4,000 local charging points in a £20million scheme. He declared: “2011 could be the year the electric car took off.”
Ministers want to cut greenhouse gas emissions by reducing the number of petrol and diesel cars and replacing them with electric models. At the same time the Government is making electricity generation greener.
From next month the Government is offering grants of 25 per cent of an electric car’s showroom value up to a cap of £5,000.
The first three cars will be the Mitsubishi iMiEV, the Mercedes-Benz Smart fortwo ED and the Peugeot iOn. The Citroen CZero, Nissan Leaf and Tata Vista EV will be available early next year with the Toyota Prius Plug-in, the Vauxhall Ampera and the Chevrolet Volt on sale in 2012.
The new regions installing local charging points are the East of England, the Midlands, Greater Manchester, Northern Ireland and Scotland.
London, Milton Keynes and the North East are already installing 11,000 charge points.
But the electric cars are still expensive. Even with a £5,000 grant the Mitsubishi iMiEV and Nissan Leaf will cost £23,990 while the Vauxhall Ampera will cost £28,995.
RAC Foundation director Professor Stephen Glaister said: “We support the Government grant. While this makes ultra-green cars cheaper, it doesn’t make them cheap.
“The £43million being made available until early 2012 means at least 8,600 will benefit from the subsidy. That is out of the 28 million cars in the UK and annual new car sales of around two million.

“Clearly we are still a long way from an affordable mass market for these vehicles, but this is a very welcome step in the right direction.” AA president Edmund King said: “The grants for electric cars will be an important catalyst for change. Electric and plug-in hybrid cars will be an important part of motoring, particularly in urban areas in the future.”
Paul Everitt, the chief executive of the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders, said: “The transition to ultra-low carbon vehicles is a great opportunity.”

Read more: express.co.uk/posts/view/217 … z18C9UEyl9

China Link Investigated in Renault Spy Case

By DAVID GAUTHIER-VILLARS and SEBASTIAN MOFFETT

PARIS—Chinese interests may be behind a high-level corporate espionage case related to Renault SA’s electric car program that has led to the suspension of three company managers, according to a person familiar with the matter.

Renault hasn’t given any details as to why it suspended the three managers earlier this week, saying only that they had been involved in a serious breach of confidentiality that put important company assets at risk. In addition to conducting its own internal probe into the breach, the car maker is also expected to file a criminal complaint against the three as early as Monday, said the person familiar with the matter.

The French government, which owns 15% of Renault, is taking a close interest in the case. While Renault hasn’t formally filed a complaint with authorities, France’s secret services began looking into the matter after receiving information suggesting Chinese interests may be involved, according to the same person.

It was unclear Friday whether the French government is looking into Chinese companies or individuals.

Renault declined to make any comment on the case on Friday. The car maker has not revealed the identities of the three managers, citing French corporate law.

The case has alarmed French politicians. France’s Industry Minister Eric Besson, on Thursday called the case “economic warfare.”

On Friday, a Renault manager identified himself as one three suspended over the matter. Matthieu Tenenbaum said via his lawyer that he was stunned by the suggestion of espionage, and that he is waiting to hear any official accusations.

Mr. Tenenbaum, a manager in Renault’s electric vehicle program, had been expelled from his workplace on Monday, his lawyer, Thibault de Montbrial said in an interview. This was done “without any explanation apart from a short, enigmatic: ‘We know what you’ve done. You had best confess,’” said Mr. de Montbrial, who declined to comment on other details of the matter.

Renault declined to comment on Mr. de Montbrial’s statement.

Read More

Renault Executive Cites Global Network
It is still not clear exactly what technology may have been divulged. The core component of an electric vehicle is the battery and associated electronics, which determine how far it can drive before being recharged. However, the high cost of batteries is a major barrier to turning electric vehicles into a mass market product.

Electric vehicles require a host of surrounding technologies—for example to connect the battery to the power train that propels the car. Charging and swapping run-down batteries are another challenge the industry must meet in order to make the vehicles popular.

Renault and its Japanese partner, Nissan Motor Co., which share the same CEO, Carlos Ghosn, have invested a combined €4 billion ($5.19 billion) into electric vehicles. Mr. Ghosn has forecast that electric vehicles will represent 10% of global automobile sales in 10 years.

One Nissan official said he was afraid that the accused Renault managers might have shared crucial know-how with outsiders.

But another Nissan official said that Nissan provided Renault with key battery technology on a “black box basis,” meaning Renault is not party to the battery’s chemistry or intellectual property.

Renault plans to roll out four models over the next year or two. The Fluence compact sedan and an electric version of the Kangoo small van are scheduled to go on sale later this year. Nissan released its Leaf electric car in Japan and the U.S. at the end of last year.

—David Pearson and Chester Dawson contributed to this article.
online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 … 34898.html

Car spy case: Renault’s Patrick Pelata remains upbeat

Mr Pelata said Renault had been the victim of an organised international network
Continue reading the main story
Global Car Industry

Patrick Pelata told Le Monde newspaper data about Renault’s electric car programme may have leaked, but its vital technology secrets were safe.

Renault suspended three senior managers on Monday after an investigation into the possible leaking of electric vehicle secrets to rivals.

France’s industry minister refused to speculate whether China was involved.

Eric Besson had previously described the case at Renault, which is 15% state-owned, as “economic warfare”, and French President Nicolas Sarkozy has asked the intelligence service to investigate.

Sources within Renault suspect the final recipient of the stolen information was likely to have been a rival in China.

Advanced technology

Without pointing fingers, Mr Pelata said the theft, which was detected last August and led to four months of internal investigations, was “the work of professionals”.

“Renault is the victim of an organised international network,” he told Le Monde’s weekend edition.

Renault and its partner Nissan have invested extensively in electric vehicle technology
“After a few weeks, we came to the conclusion that we were facing an organised collection of economic, technological and strategic interests located to serve abroad,” added Mr Pelata.

He said the theft may have included details about the costs and economic model of Renault’s high-profile multi-billion euro electric vehicle programme, but not the “golden nuggets” of its technology, including some 200 patents that are being lodged.

Mr Pelata said the theft involved three key Renault executives, whose identities he did not wish to confirm.

One of the three - whom he said would face a preliminary hearing before facing a likely dismissal and possible criminal charges - is reportedly a member of the carmaker’s management committee.

The right-leaning Le Figaro newspaper had reported earlier that the information passed on relates to the technology in the battery and the engine of electrical vehicles that will be rolled out after 2012.

But Mr Pelata said “nothing critical” about the company’s innovative technology had been leaked.

“It’s serious, but not as bad as if it had been the technology,” he said. “Whether it’s the chemistry of the electrodes, the structure of the batteries, the different elements of assembling, be it the charger or the engine itself, we feel ok.”

He added that the programme had not lost “one day” as a result of the theft and was still on schedule.

The BBC’s Christian Fraser, in Paris, says it is a mark of how seriously the French government is taking this breach of trust that it has asked the intelligence service to investigate.

Car manufacturing is an important part of the French economy, and a major employer, our correspondent says.

One of the biggest advantages that Western carmakers have is their advanced technology, which enables them to compete against cheaper labour costs outside Europe.

The carmaker, alongside its partner Nissan, has invested heavily in electric vehicle technology.

Both plan to launch a number of new electric vehicles over the next two years.
bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12142299

Hi Jamie, did you know that BMW is going to start to produce its new electric car ‘Project I’ in 2013? Now, the most exciting thing about Project I is that it will be manufactured at Leipzig BMW plant!

No I certainly didn’t know that Torsten.

Great news - If it carries on like this Leipzig will be getting as big as Engelsdorf soon. :slight_smile:

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Hi Jamie, now you do know that the Project I model is going to be manufactured in Leipzig. Here some more info on that: BMW’s high-tech plant in Leipzig will be the first production site for zero-emission electric cars in Germany. Until 2013, around €400 million will be invested for the production of the Megacity Vehicle (MCV). The expansion of the plant will create approximately 800 jobs.

By the way, have you heard of the Straddling Bus project by the Chinese?

Amazing… Straddling? Im afraid to ask Torsten

Are they riding on top of it? :slight_smile:

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It’s a bus system with cars moving beneath the bus while the bus is moving too: youtube.com/watch?v=Hv8_W2PA0rQ

Pure logic - A Virtual bus… still quite amazing.

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Petrol to hit £6 a gallon after pipeline leak sends oil prices rocketin
g
By DAILY MAIL REPORTER
Last updated at 2:14 PM on 11th January 2011

The price of petrol could reach £6 a gallon for the first time after the price of oil was pushed up by an accident at a major American pipeline.
The leak at the Trans-Alaska system, which carries an estimated 15 per cent of all U.S. crude oil production, has added yet another rise to forecourt prices that have climbed rapidly since the start of the year.
Having initially been pushed up by a rise in fuel duty, the VAT hike also affected prices at the pump and, according to petrolprices.com, a website which measures the average price in the UK, it now costs 127.8p per litre for unleaded and 132.05p for diesel.

Rise: Petrol prices will reach £6 per gallon if the average price of a litre of unleaded hits 132p
Almost 400 forecourts are already charging 130p per litre for unleaded, and some are even selling at 140p.
If the average price reaches 132p per litre then it will be the equivalent of £6 per gallon.
The accident in Alaska has led to the shutdown of the pipeline by BP and its partners, forcing the price of oil up by 2.3 per cent to $95.46 a barrel in London, while speculators are trying to force prices over the $100 mark.
The AA says that every $2 added to the price of a barrel equates to 1p at the pump.

Read more: dailymail.co.uk/news/article … z1AmEtbhcM

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I forgot to mention that the actual name for the electric model BMW is going to manufacture is ‘MegaCity Vehicle’. Project I stands for the entire process of creating electric cars in addition to the traditional combustion engine brands.

Electric car project on Aran Islands
Updated: 19:21, Friday, 14 January 2011

The Aran Islands will benefit from an electric car trial as part of a collaboration between Sustainable Energy Ireland and the Dept of Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs.

Six One News: Aran Islands in electric cars trial
The Aran Islands has been selected to take part in a three-year trial of electric vehicles.
The pilot project is a collaboration between Sustainable Energy Ireland and the Department of Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs.
Eight householders on the Aran Islands will be provided with a bright orange electric car, with six going to Inis Mór and one each to Inis Meain and Inis Oírr.
The Aran Islands were selected as an ideal test location due to the abundance of wind and ocean energy.
Drivers of the Mega e-City three-door hatchback will pay €12 for the lease of the vehicle.
The main cost is a €400 payment for the installation of a charge point close to home.
The overall running cost per year is estimated to be around €90.
The aim of the project is to increase the number of electric vehicles on the islands and to eventually generate enough energy to provide electricity, heat and transport for the islands.
Different households will be chosen to take part in the project each year and the vision is to have no carbon fuel of any kind in the future.
more with video - rte.ie/news/2011/0114/electric_car.html

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You´re right, Torsten, the oil industry is very strong and has adopted the methane drilling and -extraction business as well ages ago. But as for their strategy regarding electric motors I´m not sure. What could match their interests better as if electricity would have been produced by steam turbines which work on a really low rate of efficiency?

So, while we are at burning fossile fuel why not directly by combustion engines in cars and try to lower the carbon dioxide output, rather than change the combustion power to electricity on a low efficiency? This is how we also might protect the climate better. At least, as long as there is no better way of electricity production possible.

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[size=150]Wireless charging for electric vehicles hits the road[/size]

Updated 14:01 23 January 2014 by Paul Marks

Forget the charging cable: breakthroughs in inductive charging for electric vehicles mean drivers just park over a pad in the road to get more juice

I’M ON a bus headed for Bletchley Park, but not to visit the UK’s second-world-war codebreaking centre, I’m just along for the ride.

That’s because I’m on an electric bus that is one of the first vehicles to use a revolutionary inductive charging technology. Its batteries charge wirelessly when the bus stops to pick up passengers. With no need to plug in to charge, it’s a breakthrough that should speed up the widespread adoption of electric vehicles (EV).

Charging an EV is a laborious process. The owner has to find a charging point, connect up their cable and leave the car for some hours. It’s inconvenient, and cables can easily get lost or damaged.

Wireless power transfer technology was developed decades ago, but low efficiency meant it was restricted to industrial settings, providing power for robotic vehicles and cranes, for example. That is finally changing.

The wireless system relies on the well-known principle of electromagnetic induction. A magnetic field generated by an alternating current in a primary coil induces a current in a nearby secondary coil. What is new is technology that allows for an energy-transfer efficiency of 90 per cent or higher.

Engineers John Boyes and Grant Covic at the University of Auckland in New Zealand worked out the optimal design for the shape of the coils to minimise energy losses. They also figured out how power can be transferred when the coils are misaligned – so it still functions even if you are terrible at parking. The magnetic field has to be controlled so it stays within a safe limit, otherwise metal carried by passengers, from coins to pacemakers, could heat up.

Two firms – IPT Technology of Efringen-Kirchen in Germany and Qualcomm Halo of London – have licensed the Auckland patents and are developing their own variants.

On 9 January, the UK city of Milton Keynes launched a full-scale electric bus service, plying a 24-kilometre route with eight buses running from the city centre to Bletchley, charged using IPT’s pads.

Two of the stops my bus arrives at have power coils embedded in the ground and covered by 3-metre-square toughened pads. Using markings on the road and kerb, the driver aligns the bus, with its pickup coil fitted underneath, over the pad to establish a magnetically coupled link. And that’s it: after some wireless authentication to identify the vehicle, the bus’s battery pack gets a 120-kilowatt charge for 10 minutes during a built-in timetable stop. The bus still uses diesel, too, but only for its heating system, says John Miles of London-based firm Arup, who is a consultant on the project.

IPT Technology’s wireless chargers also supply power to buses on two routes in Genoa and Turin in Italy. After successfully trialling a wirelessly charged Mercedes EV, the firm is planning to expand production of its devices for consumer EVs, says product manager Mathias Wechler.

Qualcomm Halo is developing 3-kilowatt chargers for the Renault Fluence, a four-door family-size car. They are just 25 centimetres square and 2.2 cm deep, with road pads that are 75 cm square and 3.3 cm deep. “In the next two to three years wireless charging will definitely become an option for EVs,” says director Joe Barrett.

In a test of the technology’s potential, Paul Drayson, a British racing driver and entrepreneur, last October set the world land-speed record for a lightweight EV in a racing car charged by one of Qualcomm Halo’s wireless pads. The company’s technology will also charge the safety cars in Formula-E – the electric version of Formula 1 which kicks off later this year.

“Charging without the faff of using a cable is a very significant driver of future electric car adoption,” says Drayson. Back on my bus, John Loughhead, who directs the UK Energy Research Centre in London, is optimistic. “It doesn’t remove all the barriers to widespread EV use. But it certainly chips away at some of them.”

Correction: When this article was first published on 22 January 2014, it misstated the charge that the Milton Keynes bus gets while waiting at its stop.

This article appeared in print under the headline “Invisible charge”

newscientist.com/article/mg2 … vXyU2J_u-k

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It’s interesting to read this thread again now 8 years later. Now, electric cars are a reality and will see quite some growth in popularity this year.

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